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Should we accept hostels and B&Bs as organizations ?

Yes

32% (138 votes)

59% (251 votes)

I can't tell

9% (38 votes)

Total votes: 427

Hostels and B&B

Submitted by jchandler38 on Sat, 2007-12-08 06:13.

I am not in favour of these additions, for they would certainly clutter the map. Possibly IYHA hostels but with a different coloured flag.
The local knowledge of your WS hosts and the opportunity to learn a little of the way of life in their country makes the WS list a wonderful experience. Roger, you are running a great set up.

I have come across a few members who have no contact details whatsoever, not even an address. Is there any use in having them listed? The same for members who are unable to accommodate touring cyclists at all. These members just clutter the map. I feel that if members do not respond to your annual request for acknowledging their intent to continue membership, they should be removed from the list, as again they just add clutter.

Would it be possible to place the desired amount of notice requested by the host next to their name in the initial list as it would save time for the would be guest when they are only a few days from their potential host? Two weeks is easily 700 to 1000 miles in fair conditions.

The internet gives you the location of IYHA hostels and once you are able to get to a hostel you can normally pick up a free map of the country showing the locations with addresses, phone numbers etc. Unfortunatley they do not give GPS locations, which would be very useful.

Roger, many thanks for your list.

Jeff Chandler

Contact details, misc

Submitted by rfay on Sat, 2007-12-08 14:13.

Hi Jeff - thanks for your comments -

* Every member on the list has at a minimum an email address, a city, province, and country. If you find one that does not have this, please let me know. I like to have things cleaned up (and these are required in the form). randy at randyfay.com.

* We try to keep the member list clean - members who bounce emails or who don't log in for more than a year are hidden - please read this post: New cleanup features.

* The desired notice is included in the List members on one page. You might want to use that for your if the preferred notice is important. My strategy when touring is to contact as early as possible, but if I'm late, I send a note or make a call saying "I know you prefer more notice, so just say no, but I'll be passing through ..."

Again, thanks very much for your comments. Thanks for your hospitality to touring cyclists!

-Randy - randy at randyfay.com

B and B's as org

Submitted by slade_clyde on Thu, 2007-12-06 10:34.

I voted no but a separate list of Orgs would be a good idea.

accept hostels and B&Bs?

Submitted by htt98 on Tue, 2007-12-04 19:03.

I just voted 'NO'. However if Roger and the Warm Showers List could set up an esentially separate site which only linked to the 'NOT FOR MONEY' WSL site ... and make a dollar; that would be fine with me.

It spoils the idea

Submitted by vonhubenu on Mon, 2007-12-03 12:59.

Having people on the list that aren't cyclists and aren't part of the "offer a bed for free at home for having a free bed abroad" is a clear "no way!".
There are plenty of ways to find a stay you have to pay for.

Hostels & b&Bs

Submitted by kblades on Tue, 2007-06-05 09:49.

I say no to adding these. It's pretty easy in most countries to find hostels, B&Bs and campgrounds through other books and tourist info brochures. It would clog the website and I thinkit would be easy to make a mistake and pedal to a B&B when you were expecting a person's home. As far as I know when I joined warm showers it was about cyclists and not commercial efforts. cheers, Kevin

Should we accept hostels

Submitted by ninness on Mon, 2007-06-04 23:23.

The essence of offering hospitality to visiting cyclists is to me an acknowledgement of respect to the visitor. I feel it would be unfortunate of hostels etc were seen to compete with the independent hosts - they must only have approached Warm Showers as they can see the potential market. However a few guidebooks indicate hostels which welcome cyclists, but I have not found these guidebooks check/ask if these places provide cyclists with say repair stands/tools they can borrow/use, safe covered lock-ups for bikes ..? Perhaps a separate strand contributed by cyclists (or checked by cyclists) which covers these cyclist specific features would be beneficial as not all areas have hosting families

fellowship over $$$

Submitted by treehouse potter on Mon, 2007-06-04 15:43.

Maybe hostels would not be a bad idea, if the cyclists can stay free. But definitely not the for-profit B&Bs or hotels. The whole concept of the fellowship we offer when we open our homes to cyclists is what makes Warm Showers so wonderful. We have been blessed with some beautiful young people who have now become part of our journey. I think those connections are what set this program apart from commercial travel. You should try to keep that spirit.

B&B's

Submitted by Mello Velo on Fri, 2007-06-01 20:39.

Uhhhh.... No!

hostels and B&Bs

Submitted by jlharp617 on Sat, 2007-01-13 19:14.

I voted NO on the poll, but really see no problem listing hostels and b/bs as long as they are not intergrated with the free host stuff. Seperate map,etc. Might be a way for Roger to pick up a little extra change. Running these type of sites is very time consuming and they carry significant expenses.

What defines the Warm Showers List?

Submitted by vacuvox on Mon, 2006-11-13 10:53.

Hats off to Roger for recognising the membership's interest and stake in this decision. I pledge to make a donation to WSL now, and each time I am hosted by other members - and will encourage others to do the same, including future WSL guests. Meanwhile - thanks for the vote. I will use it to vote "No"!

The WSL membership requirements to which I agreed consist almost entirely of a willingness to host other cyclist-members without expectation of remuneration. It seems to me this principle is foundational - and it is clever, incredible, unusual and, I think, invaluable. Commercial membership, while not inherently a bad idea, is completley opposite in concept and spirit to the conditions that define WSL membership.

We owe several huge cheers to Roger Gravel for instigating and cultivating the WSL list, and creating the website! And cheers to all of us who conspire to be freely and openly hospitable to each other!
cheers
Phil Strong - Toronto

What defines the Warm Showers List?

Submitted by marymadison on Wed, 2006-11-29 12:16.

I absolutely agree with almost everything that Phil Strong of Toronto says, especially in relation to the wonderful job Roger Gravel has accomplished implementing a wonderful, novel idea for touring bikers. The idea of making a donation to the WSL cause is an excellent one which I ascribe to as I believe Roger is doing a lot of work with little or no reimbursment.

In the year 2005 I celebrated my 70th year on the road biking alone and self-contained from Wolf Point, MT to Bar Harbor, MA and back by two different routes, a total of about 5000 miles. At the time I did not know about WSL. On return I read about about the organization in Adventure Cycling's on line Bike Bits, and signed up as a hostess. I only did some short trips last summer, and as I live in Wolf Point, MT, right on the Northern Tier route, I ended up hosting 22 wonderful cross country bikers and having a wonderful experience doing it. Saying this, early on I voted for adding Hostels and B&Bs to the WSL list and watched the vote go from slightly in favor to the definitely not in favor position it holds now. I have since read the arguments and have changed my opinion, or perhaps would fall more into the "I can't tell" category. I definitely do not think commercial organizations such as B&Bs need to be on this unique, non-profit list. However, I do have one thing to say in favor of hostels, especially the non-profit International Youth Hostel Federation, which promotes a less expensive alternative to world travel, international peace, and inter-relationships with people of all countries and backgrounds. Fortunately for me most of them no longer hold to having to be a youth in any manner except perhaps your mind. I have never seen a IYHF host profiting much or getting rich either.

Unfortunately they have had some difficulties in recent years and some of them have gone by the wayside in some areas. I am getting too lengthy, as sometimes seems to come with old age so I will get to the point, i.e., is there a way to support the non-profit hostels in areas especially that have very few facilities or people on the WSL, in order to provide an alternative? Or does Adventure Cycling do a good enough job of listing all possible alternatives, making this an unncessary addition to Roger's wonderful list? I throw this out, not as a hard held opinion, but for discussion by members.

Mary Madison - Wolf Point, MT

No No definitely NO. I

Submitted by Niko and Noelle on Sun, 2006-10-29 16:52.

No No definitely NO. I completely agree with Alice. There is no use for Hostels Hotels and BBs on this list. When you are on the road, you know where to sleep, on the commercial way. Warm Showers exists to create a link between peolpe passionnated by traveling on bike. Warm Showers is not a one more guide of where to sleep, it is the venue where people want to exchange different experiences of their trips. The power of Warm Showers is to be non commercial, openig the list to hotels and B&Bs will change the way we see the site, it will change the spirit of travelers, and it will break the link between travelers and hosts. * Le monde est beau, regardons le à l'envers c'est encore plus rigolo !

Great idea

Submitted by nhorley on Wed, 2006-10-11 13:30.

It would really be a big help with planning if B&Bs and hostels were on the same map as warm showers people, but with different colour tags.

Campings list !!!!

Submitted by dorivalprado on Fri, 2006-10-20 18:51.

That´s a great idea !!! But I´d like do add a list of campings too.

B&Bs

Submitted by rjvoss14 on Sat, 2006-10-21 06:33.

B&Bs now camping , next they will want Motels and Hotels. I think you should just leave it at the Warm shower list period. Dick in Minneapolis

Yes to HOSTEL LIST, IF...

Submitted by wzrdone on Wed, 2006-10-11 03:45.

I would like a SEPERATE list for places that charge. It would be great to know of bike friendly communities and their organizations too. If this is too much for Warm Showers, I understand. I have been inspired in traveling, and in getting help to try to do more when I get back to CA, USA. In traveling in Spain it would have been nice to have a list of places that are actually bike friendly, and open. So far it is really hit and miss, with some people who seem to think my bike is a filthy thing that will tear up wall, and others who understand that it needs to be safe and sound. Season in Spain has a tremendous impact on whether or not the place is actually availble; governement tourism lists are not necessarily accurate.

Hostels and B&B

Submitted by mapper360 on Mon, 2006-10-09 22:03.

The hostel concept seems very similar to the old AYH concept of home hostels that seemed to have declined in favor of the larger urban sites. These "home' style and other rural hostels can add a valuable option to the touring cyclist. I have also found that the B&Bs in our area seem to treat bicyclists well, but do not know if this is true everywhere. (Same can be said of different style campgrounds.) So, in general, I'm not opposed. However, the following need to be considered.

1) Separate lists so it is very clear if you are looking at a potential facility that is a membership format - such as a Hostel; a commercial high end wine and cheese B&B; or, a "low-cost" bike friendly style B&B; or, the current style hosts

2) NO use of WSL lists for marketing,

3) Some form of rating as to the bicycle friendlness of these "professional hosts", this is where a more commercial location must have customer service as opposed to current hosts who are mostly offering hospitality in the spirit of reciprocity and generosity.

4) A requirement to intentionally go to the commercial site rather than having these type of facilities come up as part of the general list,

5) No problem with having some form of pre-inclusion tests, checklist, standards and/or a "bike friendly" commitment by the hostel or B&B - as mentioned by others.

6) No problem with some support going to the benefit of WSL upkeep for the site as long as the small rural B&B's (who may be the most bicycle friendly) are not priced out or the original WSL concept gets lost. In short, more options are great if it is clear who is who and what is what.

back from the bunker

Submitted by Robert Mink on Mon, 2006-10-09 01:24.

It seems that the common theme here is the „cycling experience” i.e. accommodations that transcend a mere roof over the head and provide both a social environment for interaction and caters to the specific needs of the touring cyclist. Just because hostels and B&B’s are commercial, this does not de facto preclude them from offering the both the environment and services that us touring cyclists relish. To have qualified hostels and B&B’s in some shape or form on the list, either separately, with a fee or whatever, serves both the touring community and awards those entrepreneurs who have invested in developing cyclist friendly accommodations. To automatically lump these people, many of whom are passionate about cycling and their businesses, with Motel Six is rather grievous. I don’t know too many commercial enterprises that provide cyclists with a work stand , lube, tools and pump and basic replacement parts like our future B&B will do, this in addition to pick up-drop off services, expert advice, laundry facilities and Poland’s only homemade jalapeńo and habanero salsa’s (an oasis in the bland sea of CEE cuisine). I agree that not all commercial enterprises are equal, they should meet criteria, including the oft mentioned discounts for list members. The German Bike und Bett organization provides excellent guidelines on what makes a B&B/ hotel cycling friendly. If a commercial enterprise follows these guidelines and provides established list members with a discount, I think it benefits both. Check out: http://www.bettundbike.de/ on the bottom of the page is an option for English. I would add free or very cheap Internet Access so that guests can touch base with home. In closing, I’ve been a member of the list since 1997. While I have hosted several cyclists, warm shower members in this neck in the woods are few and far between so I never had the opportunity to stay with any hosts. I know that if the map showed cyclist friendly accommodations with a ratings system by members, it would be a great resource for my family and me. We should also award those people who actually answer our needs and requirements. Back to the bunker, Bob Mink

Listings created by satisfied users

Submitted by kf5nd on Sat, 2006-10-07 05:42.

If a cyclist stays at a hostel, and likes the people and the facility, why not allow the cyclist to create a brief listing and recommendation for the hostel (for free)? Having customer-generated content will automatically filter out the unhospitable, highly commercial facilities, and will still add more options, and have them all in one place for convenience. You know, here in much of the US, the Warm Showers coverage is very sparse. More options which are also vetted, quality options are good!

No. Completelly different objective

Submitted by aliceavelo on Tue, 2006-10-03 17:25.

Hi, When I use the warm shower list, the idea is not so much about having a roof above my head for the night (although it comes as a real relief in some countries), but more about meeting people that have a certain understanding of what I'm doing, and fitting in their routine. Usually I'd stay more then a day too... So this list is not about finding a place to stay, which is a real easy thing to do when you cycle anyway... but about meeting people that live in the area we travel in. I really think that accepting commercial organizations will not enhance the list at all, quite the contrary... And really has nothing in common with this list.

No No definitely NO. I

Submitted by Niko and Noelle on Sun, 2006-10-29 16:49.

Cam and Jane

Submitted by yibbyspop on Thu, 2006-10-05 00:43.

Cam and Jane Absolutely agree with Alice who said it so well!

Separate list

Submitted by biker-dan on Sun, 2006-10-01 19:53.

I agree with the idea of a separate list

No "With a caveat"

Submitted by slackpat on Sat, 2006-09-30 20:10.

In Australia a B&B can be more expensive than a motel, lots of pubs have cheap accomadation in country towns. Do you list caravan parks and camping grounds as well. I am resonably sure that most people pick up a lonely planet/rough guide ecetera before they set off on a trip.

Yes as they may be beneficial

Submitted by Vince1231 on Fri, 2006-09-29 13:03.

I agree with the Bob Mink, the man who's wife is to dress up like Eva Braun. There could be some type of discount for bicyclists. Or being allowed to camp for free, etc.. Many bicyclists would want to know of B&B's or hostels along the route.

No, because they don't fit

Submitted by schuma on Fri, 2006-09-29 02:15.

No, because they don't fit exactly into the hospitality category.

hostels and B&Bs

Submitted by marymadison on Fri, 2006-09-29 01:06.

I believe they are a good alternative if there is not a good warm showers or camp site in the area. It would be a big help in planning trips. However, as they are commercial, they should have to pay a small fee to be listed. I agree with someone else, i.e., it would be nice for bikers who hear about them via the warmshowers web site could receive a discount. Mary Madison

yes, with a cavet

Submitted by Robert Mink on Fri, 2006-09-29 00:26.

For the touring cyclist both B&B’s and hostels are good overnight alternatives, especially if there is not a warm shower member in the area. Having them on the list would enable touring cyclists to plan their trips. Because the list is non-commercial, perhaps a nominal fee for placing the hostel / B&B on the site is warranted. This would in effect subsidize the site for the rest of us. Another alternative is to have the hostels and b&bs provide members with a discount. My wife and I are planning on opening “Bob’s Bar and Bike Bunker” in the lake district on the German / Polish border. Wife is not convinced that on karaoke night she has to dress like Eva Braun and belt out “stand by your man”, but that is an other matter… The location is near several trans-European bicycle routes. For warm shower list members, camping would be free with only nominal fees for (warm) shower and use of work shop, laundry etc… A days work in my hot pepper green house could also be bartered. Rooms would be provided with a discount to members of at least three months standing. I think this would adhere to the spirit of the list. What do the list members think about this? Robert Mink

Bob's Bar and Bike Bunker

Submitted by Diane Emerson on Sun, 2006-10-01 22:38.

If your bunker would pay a bit for advertising on the Warm Showers' website, and give discounts to cyclists, and allow us to work off our stay, I am all for it. I look forward to visiting! Diane Emerson

Conditional yes

Submitted by Diane Emerson on Thu, 2006-09-28 21:01.

I would allow those organisations to join under two conditions: 1. They give a 25-50% discount to bicyclists who ride in on their bikes 2. They pay Roger handsomely for the privilege of membership, and/or minimal advertising on the warm showers website. If these organisations are being considered because of possible revenue, I would personally prefer that cycle travelers pay a membership fee to Roger, to help offset the costs involved in keeping this going. They need to bring something to the party. Diane

Ditto Diane

Submitted by jeffmika on Wed, 2006-11-08 16:32.

I agree with Diane...everyone on the list has agreed to open their home to other cyclists or they don't get the list.That to me is what keeps the spirit of cycle touring alive and well !..everyone on the list brings something to the table..I think it needs to be the same for hotels,B&B's etc...what are they doing to promote cycle touring??...just providing a place to stay is not enough because places to stay are everywhere...I think there should be a protocol for ANY business we invite to be associated with the list...otherwise why would we want to overload the list with commercial BS ??..My vote is for a separate booklet that caters to cyclists..with services over and above what they would offer to drive in customers...Hmm??

Hostels or B&B

Submitted by Tico on Wed, 2006-09-27 03:50.

I wouldn't mind having here a (separate) list, but they should have a minimum requirement for being alowed in it! This minimum requirements would be something like a decent shelter for the bikes, and why not a discount for WSL members?

Tico
------
Ride your bike.
Every Day!
http://www.VouDeBicicleta.eu/
---------

separate list

Submitted by franco on Thu, 2006-09-28 15:35.

nice idea; I would add as requirements buffet breakfast and laundry use/service included or at a VERY reasonable price. Otherwise I'm indifferent to the question.